It just gets worse and worse...

[drakyndra]

And now we are up to Chapter 9 of the MsScribe epic.

And it has to be one of the most horrific accounts of fandom I have ever come across. Some pooor woman with cancer getting stomped on by a whole bunch of BNFs just because she asked one of them to link her fundraising website. After they had been going on about how fandom supports it's own and all that, too.

I don't think I have ever been so appalled by fandom as a whole. The things that were said...

Comments

[melata-fic.livejournal.com]

I know. It's rather horrible. But fandom was mostly manipulated into it.

[drakyndra.livejournal.com]

It was sort of amusingly crazy before - like some big conspiracy theory. This just gets horrifying, manipulated or not. And it's terribly depressing when you're an optimist like me who always assumes the best of people.

[livii.livejournal.com]

I really can't get the words out, but it was *the* most disgraceful thing I have ever personally witnessed.

Not only the fandom supports its own, part - but when some people had the 'nerve' to question whether the robbery that lost Cassie and Co. their laptops had actually happened - which I personally have always thought was a very good question - well, those people were ruthlessly attacked. People start going into the cancer woman's journal and calling her a liar - and people like Heidi, who they were going there on behalf of, basically shrugged and said "I can't control them, I didn't ask them to do that". And if anyone challenged the people who said the woman was a liar, they freaked out on you.

The whole thing was so depressing that I'm actually depressed over it again. I lost a lot of faith. I lost a whole ton of love for the fandom, and I wasn't in those circles (though I had heidi on my flist, which she promptly was removed from).

Argh, must stop rambling about it. :(

[drakyndra.livejournal.com]

It really is quite horrible. I mean, skepticism is one thing, but this kind of accusation and trollery is horrific. You can disbelieve someone without insulting them, you know.

[ishie]

Entire books could be written on the psychological motivations and effects of this kind of thing. Encyclopedias!

The most depressing part is how some of the people who were involved still can't see how their individual and as-part-of-the-mob actions were wrong.

[drakyndra.livejournal.com]

I remember using Harmonians as an example to remember some theories for Psych last year. Maybe I should try it again with this?

And it's back to that quote, isn't it? A person is smart, people are stupid.

[tavella.livejournal.com]

Actually, the Christina thing I remember, and it was Not Quite Like That. There was much attacking of said BNF for not linking to her because OMIGOD she's dying of cancer. Except when you read Christina's site, you found out that she was in remission, had been for some years, and what she wanted money for was to get her stomached stapled. In particular, even though her medical insurance would cover it, she wanted it done at the Mayo Clinic, and wanted people to pay for the hotel rooms and so on for her staying there. Even though there were many local options for the surgery.

When these facts were pointed out, many people went ballistic, screaming ever louder but she's DYING of CANCER!

I don't doubt there was rudeness on both sides, but the pro-Christina side? Completely insane.

[livii.livejournal.com]

Oh, fuck you.

The attacking of Heidi was not just because she wouldn't link to 4Christina; it was because she had just organized a whip-round for laptops, had stated that fandom takes care of its own, and had defended having it be a publically-visible whip-round on that basis. She then proceeded to be, at the very least, terribly obtuse about what Sapphire wanted for her mum, and defended not doing anything about it because she didn't know Sapph. It's a circle of hell. Plus, after heidi's 'friends' started going over to troll Christina's journal - a violation of all fandom ethics - she refused to do anything about it.

Christina's site did not prove that she had been in remission for years; and it was stated that even if the money was for the stomach surgery, it was a necessary part of her treatment. She had *no* medical insurance as her husband had been laid off.

People freaked out over her dying of cancer because shitstains on humanity like msscribe went over to her journal, while she was in hospital, and called her a liar and all sorts of horrible things.

And you know what? Even if it's not true - even if Christina really was a twelve-year old boy who wanted the money to go roll around in and make paper airplanes out of or use it to snort crack - anyone who would go say things like that is OUT OF THEIR FUCKING MINDS and deserves no defending. "Rudeness"? Try being a total cunt. You seen the anonymous comments that it turns out msscribe was making all on her own? You see going and trolling the journal of a woman who ostensibly was in the hospital? There is no defence, ever, for that type of behaviour.

[Sorry, drakyndra, for wanking all over your journal]. :(

[gunderpants.livejournal.com]

Wow. You're an evil, evil person.

Just for the record, not every person who has gastric bypass surgery for weight loss does it for cosmetic reasons. A lot of the time, surgeons aren't insured to operate for some conditions with people above a certain weight or BMI, and some of them have no choice but to have a gastric bypass in order to allow them to have operations that will improve their quality of life or prolong it.

Even then, that's assuming that the surgery was for weight loss, which it may not have been. Here's to you, chump.

[biting-moopie.livejournal.com]

(My apologies to Drakyndra for barging into her journal.)

I'm someone who thought that the original post regarding Heidi not wanting to post a link was unnecessary. While I do think that things could have been handled in a more diplomatic manner, it’s understandable that Heidi was reluctant to endorse a person and situation with which she had no familiarity. I hope that with that knowledge, you'll give me a chance and hear me out.

This is why people were angry. Christina was very ill. She was in the hospital at the time. Her daughter was only 19 and trying to get help for her mum. Then, all of a sudden, the two of them are attacked and insulted in their own journals and on JF, told that they’re liars and how DARE they ask for help from someone they don’t even know. It looked to many of us that it was all right for Heidi to ask strangers for donations for laptops, but when someone asked for help for something far more important, they were subjected to insults.

The exact nature of Christina’s illness is not the issue. She was ill. People knew she was ill. And they viciously attacked her anyway. That’s what made people angry. Wanting to defend your friends is understandable, but carrying on a fandom argument in the journal of a very sick woman is inexcusable. Only ONE of Heidi’s friends apologised when asked to take the argument elsewhere.

Please think about why people are angry. It’s not because Heidi refused to post a link. It’s because a sick woman and her daughter were viciously attacked for asking for help. When the people doing the attacking were asked to stop, they didn’t. When Heidi was asked to please tell her friends to stop, she didn’t.

Please, if you’re truly Heidi’s friend, then think about how all of this has made her look. How it has made you look. Remember that a true friend tells you what you need to hear, not what you want to hear. Being loyal to a friend doesn’t mean being blind to their mistakes. Take a step back and try to see this from another point of view. Right now, you’re quibbling over a very minor detail, and it’s making you look callous. I can understand that you might feel defensive but please think about how would you feel if all of this happened to someone you loved. The so-called Charitywank had me in tears because a young woman and her mother were being hurt for absolutely no reason other than stupid fandom drama.

I know this is long and I thank you for taking the time to read it. I completely admit to begging you to please, please think about why this situation makes me people so angry, both now and then. Re-read the comments explaining why, and try to see it from their points of view. Think about how you’d feel if this happened to someone you cared about.

Thanks for your time,

Moopie

[dune-drd.livejournal.com]

I've never been active in that fandom, but it makes a hell of a good read... god, even if Iwanted to, I had neither the time nor the ENERGY to do something so complicated.

[drakyndra.livejournal.com]

It's just so completely insane, and over something as petty as fandom.

[aervir.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I got to read this part last night, and it left a very bad taste in my mouth. There were personal reasons for me why some of the appalling behaviour exhibited towards a cancer patient wanted me to yell at my laptop because I didn't have some of the insane commenters to yell at.

Even though I have no idea what exactly the circumstances surrounding the cancer patient really were, trolling such a woman is one of the most horrible things I could imagine.

I mean if someone has got very good reasons to suspect that a plea for charity is just a sob story to con other users (it has happened before, hasn't it?), you can remain skeptical, warn your own friends via e-mail and start collecting evidence to back up your suspicion.

Trolling said woman, however, is not only a breach of netiquette, but it goes against the basic rules of decency.

The laptop story, on the other hand, is just ridiculous. I've never understood why Cassie Claire was mocked so often in HP fandom circles, but now I do. If someone broke into my room and stole my laptop, I'd be very, very upset, too. And I'd be touched if someone on my f-list sent me a postcard or something to cheer me up. But I'd raise the 1,500 euros which a new laptop might cost me on my own, thank you very much. That's what saving accounts are fore. Sheesh.

Um, sorry for rambling on and on in your journal. But the MSScribe is no longer that amusing...

[drakyndra.livejournal.com]

It did stop being funny, didn't it? And just became appalling.

And I agree, skepticism is one thing, but the sheer trollery that went on there - the woman in question supplied screen-caps in the comments - is one of the most horrible things I have ever seen.

And when you compare that with the laptop thing - it's a stupid comparison, really. They aren't even on the same scale. I mean, they could have both have been scams. But if they were true - Well, in one case, some woman would need to rely on public access computers. In the other, someone might die.

[lizbee.livejournal.com]

*nodnodnod*

I was heavily into HP fandom at that stage, and I remember losing a lot of my love for it (and my respect for the people involved) around this time. The SQ meltdown over OotP didn't help, either. Sockpuppets aside, the behaviour in Charitygate was just vile. I didn't even realise how vile until the Unauthorised Biography came out.

What angers me now is that people are still denying that they or Ms Scribe did anything wrong. Loyalty to your friends is lovely, but surely there comes a point where loyalty involves telling them they're being a dipshit? (On the other hand ... I read Joe Cinque's Consolation yesterday, and the parallels between that murder and Charitygate were weirdly powerful.)

[drakyndra.livejournal.com]

I was shut away in my own little corner of fandom - and from the look of the dates, I was bouncing around Firefly and Star Wars at the time, which might be how I missed a lot of it. But this really was horrific.

And I agree with you - there is loyalty, and then there is wilful denial.

[mittendorfer.livejournal.com]

I think I'll just stick to sitting at the back in my fandoms, and being jolly.

The whole story is a reminder of how fervently rabid and appalling fandom can be.

[drakyndra.livejournal.com]

It is a bit like that, yes?

[yattara.livejournal.com]

Mind if I join you?

After I had a shower, that is. Need...to...feel...clean...

[misscam.livejournal.com]

I'm all for a little healthy skeptisism in what you give your money to at times, but... Good fucking grief. In light of the money-raising for the laptop, it just looks extra foul.

[drakyndra.livejournal.com]

I think that's the most appalling bit of it all - the same people who threw money at someone to get them a laptop trolling someone else's LJ because they needed money for an operation. Skepticism is one thing, but priorities, people!

[nostalgia-lj.livejournal.com]

What amazed me is how much HP wank I recognise came from one woman and her sockpuppets. Isn't this stuff like... 40% of your wank?

[drakyndra.livejournal.com]

Well, take out any slash wank, and most of the post HBP stuff, but apart from that, it's an awful lot of wank that even if she didn't cause, she was certainly involved in.

[--kali--.livejournal.com]

God, it gets worse and worse

*loses faith in humanity*

*cries*

[drakyndra.livejournal.com]

It really, truly does.